HomeMy WebLinkAbout102599 ws/rm min.E718672
MINUTES
City Commission, Sanford, Florida
3:30 Work Session
October 25
141
19 99
The City Commission of the City of Sanford, Florida met in Work Session on Monday, October 25, 1999,
at 3:30 o'clock P.M. in the City Manager's Conference Room, Sanford City Hall, 300 North Park Avenue, Santbrd,
Florida.
Present:
Mayor-Commissioner Larry A. DaIe
Commissioner Whitey Eckstein
Commissioner Brady Lessard
Commissioner A. A. McClanahan
Commissioner Velma H. Williams
City Manager Tony VanDerworp
City Clerk Janet R. Dougherty
Absent:
City Attorney William L. Colbert
The Chairman called the meeting to order.
Mayor Dale announced that today a Lear jet based out of Sanford crashed in South Dakota, with Payne
Stewart, Van Ardan, Robert Fraley and others on board. He asked everyone to remember the families of the victims.
Interlocal Agreement with Volusia County for Midge and Mosquito Control
City Manager VanDerworp reported that this agreement was authorized b the Volusia County Commission.
The adoption of this agreement will allow Sanford to proceed with Volusia County's resources, along with Sanford's
budgeted funds, to look for the areas, and do the testing necessary, for the pre-emergence stages. It wilI also provide
equipment for pond treatment. The City will be applying for additional funds for this program through the State Agency
during next year's legislature.
Mayor Dale reported this is a pay as you go program, on an as needed basis, with Volusia County doing the
monitoring.
Office space for the International Council of Central Florida in City Hall
City Manager VanDerworp introduced Patricia Gehri, who runs the International Council of Central Florida
in the Orlando area. The Council is requesting office space, consisting of one office and some file cabinet room. The City
Manager reported the Intemational Council of Central Florida (ICCF) is a Federal/Department of State Visitor Program
affiliate, with about 90 of these organizations throughout the country. The public purpose for Seminole County
participating in the program last year was to promote Seminole County services and serve as an information source, point
of contact for international operations and management consultants, and to enhance government/economic development
relationships between countries. The City Manager further reported there are quite a few people who come through the
doors oflCCF, and ICCF IocalIy is one of five in the nation where people tend to visit every time they come to the United
States. Sanford would provide office space to ICCF, which would provide exposure for international government and
trade people, and to promote the airport and showcase Sanford.
Patricia Gehri reported there is one important part of the program that ICCF has not been able to do because
the Council has been working out of a private home. The Council has an internship program with Dr. Sadry at UCF,
giving students the ability to intern and eam one credit in Political Science, which puts them on the fast track of
understanding intemational relations. One High SchooI student does volunteer but cannot get any community service
hours because there is no liability insurance for the private home. There are now 20 young people who would like to be
involved in this intemship program, and the office space would allow them to have the exposure, and computer and web
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site support, to move ahead, including at Seminole Community College. Ms. Gehri reported they have their own xerox
machine, fax machines, computers and filing cabinets, and they pay their own phone bills. Their Council has merged with
the U. S. State Department with the level of an ambassador.
Commissioner McClanahan asked if the airport would be a better physical location for this office space.
City Manager VanDerworp reported he had reviewed the possibility of an office at the airport, but there is no space left at
the airport, in fact, it doesn't have sufficient office space for its own facilities. The City Manager further reported that the
committee to study the use of space in City Hall can make a recommendation as to where the office space for ICCF could
be available in City Hall when it makes a report to the Commission in two to three weeks. The Commission concurred
that providing office space in City Hall would be an asset to Sanford.
Boys and Girls Club options.
City Manager VanDerworp reported on the programs offered at the Boys and Girls Club, and several
options for the lease agreement. He further reported that if the City were to lease or deed the property there could be a
reverter clause dependent on these programs being offered. Commissioner McClanahan and Commissioner Willjams both
felt that deeding the property should not be an option. Commissioner Willjams felt that a new lease should be written
specifying the utilization of funds and the facilities, and specifying programs. She reported Don Miller is no longer with
the Boys and Girls Club, although he was not fired, and there is a board of about 20 or 25 people including Mr. Giannoni,
Mr. Parsell and Mr. Philpot, which has not met in the last eight or nine months.
Gary Cain, Executive Director, reported that the corporate board, which Tim Giannoni sits on, has not
convened the local advisory board, because there is no reason for them to convene.
Commissioner Willjams reported .the board members have a lot of questions about funds, not necessarily
accountability, but the utilization of funds. For example, two golf tournaments were held and all of the money raised went
back to the corporate office. Mr. Cain reported that all of the money raised from the golf tournaments came back to
Sanford. Commissioner Willjams reported there have been other funds raised, and money received from the County, that
went to the corporate office, and the board members are concemed that those funds are not being utilized for the Sanford
Boys and Girls Club. The County funds received were used in Altamonte, and she asked why grants have never been
written to utilize the money in Sanford.
Gary Cain reported the East Altamonte Club, the Midway Elementary site and the Midway Teen Center
have always been contractual where annual operating support was received from Seminole County. There was a block
grant when Seminole County built a new 5000 sq. ft. Community Center in the East Altamonte/Wynnwood community.
An RFP was done and the Boys and Girls Club was selected as the management agent. The additional $50,000 received
was for operating costs for the Community Center. He further reported there used to be one full time staff person for all of
Seminole County, and there are now four full time staff people. It was his understanding that the building in Sanford
where the existing Boys and Girls Club is located was boarded up by the City, and with a $50,000 appropriation from
United Way the Boys and Girls Club is running a very successful program in that building. Mr. Cain reported that when
money is raised by a club, it goes back to the support of that club.
Commissioner Williams reported she monitors what goes on at the Boys and Girls Club in Sanford, and she
cannot see anything being done except what the City does. She also reported it was her understanding that the parents are
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also being charged. Mr. Cain reported if the Boy and Girls Club in Sanford had to run on the $6,000 that the City gives
them to pay the staff, it wouldn't be possible. The budget is about $175,000 a year. To say the funds are not coming back
to Sanford is just not true. They have been successful in getting United Way increases every year and they raise
approximately $230,000 with a dinner, with part of those funds coming back to Seminole County, and Sanford
specifically. Even though the money coming back to Sanford is not tangible' (physical) improvements, the services and
staffing (pay and working conditions) have increased. He further reported he has never heard these concerns from the
board members.
Commissioner Willjams questioned how many times Mr. Cain had been in the Sanford Boys and Girls
Club. He responded he was there just last week, and Commissioner Willjams indicated that was the first time. He
reported he had been to that Club numerous times. Commissioner Willjams reported that these concerns were expressed
by the board members, and there were some other concerns. She reported the goals of the Boys and Girls Club throughout
the country are excellent, but her concem, and the concern of the board members in Sanford, is the utilization of funds and
whether the Sanford Boys and Girls Club is getting its fair share. Also, she is concerned about the programs. The
programs need to be of substance and be meaningful, and ones that will change the behavior of the young people.
Mr. Cain reported the report he received from the Seminole County School Board is that the programs at
the Boys and Girls Club have increased test scores in reading and math, and they would like to expand the program, but
there is no more room for computer stations. The attendance has gone up every year, and the daily average attendance is
about 65, and in the summertime the attendance goes up to about 125, with a waiting list. The building will not physically
hold any more than 125, and the staffing is kept at a 1 to 20 ratio. Mr. Cain reported he felt as if his personal integrity and
the integrity of the Boys and Girls Club are under assault, and he wants the City to understand that if it weren't for the
Boys and Girls Club the City's cost for youth programs in that area would go up dramatically. The Boys and Girls Club
Corporate Board has discussed if they could raise the money, they would like to build a full service (about a $1 million)
facility that could serve more children. If that cannot be done in Sanford, they will go elsewhere in Seminole County. Mr.
Cain shared a survey that stated 52% of the alumni of the Boys and Girls Club, 38% of which were African/Americans,
strongly agree that the Boys and Girls Club saved their lives (figuratively). He reported that this program costs from $1.00
to $10.00 a year to join. Commissioner Willjams reported it costs $35.00 a year. Mr. Cain said no, it is from $1.00 to
$10.00 a year, and in the summertime it is $15.00 for the summer program.
Commissioner Willjams said that it would be hard to find 25% or 35% of Afro/Americans who lived in
Sanford who would say the Boys and Gifts Club saved their lives, based on the programs. There needs to be more
accountability. She reported further that the reason the board members are not meeting has nothing to do with the fact that
the Corporate Board is not convening it. As far as the summer program, the Boys and Girls Club brochure says the cost is
$20.00 a week which includes lunch and a morning snack. Commissioner Williams reported that the D.O.E. provides the
lunch. Mr. Cain reported they are the sponsor for the United States Department of Agriculture (USDA), not D.O.E.,
summer food program. Commissioner Williams insisted it was D.O.E. Mr. Cain reported maybe USDA is downstream
from D.O.E., but the Boys and Girls Club is a sponsor. Commissioner Williams reported, based on the flyer, the parents
have to pay for the lunch program, and that particular program is funded by D.O.E., the school board is the vendor and the
Boys and Girls Club is the sponsor, as well as the Housing Authority, and each is reimbursed, and in some instances given
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Mr. Cain reported they have never been given an advance; they have never asked for one. They receive
about $1.13 a meal. They are open from 7:00 a.m. until 6:00 p.m. in the summertime, which is eleven hours of
programming for children. The reason there is a summer fee is because the cost goes up dramatically. Commissioner
Williams reported that the brochure says the lunch is included in the fee, and the Boys and Girls Club does not have to pay
for that program. She further reported that she is expressing the concerns of the parents, citizens and board members. She
just feels the Boys and Gifts Club needs to be a little more accountable.
Mr. Cain reported if you can find a more accountable organization he would welcome that. He is willing to
give the Commission anything and everything, other than rumor and innuendo, that it wants, and he will stand by that. The
Boys and Gifts Club has nothing to hide from and has operated a great program, and the Commission should be celebrating
what a successful program it has been. Commissioner Willjams reported she lives in that area, and Mr. Cain lives in
Orlando, and it is not rumors and iunuendos, it is fact, and she has a lot of respect for the board members. Mr. Cain
reported he does not live in Orlando, he lives in South Seminole County, and he also has a lot of respect for the board
members, he works for them. Commissioner Willjams reported, in order to get her support, she thought Mr. Cain would
take her comments as constructive criticism, and he would have the attitude that if this is the perception by the community,
and he doesn't know if these things are going on or not (he assumes they are not), but they would attempt to move in a
different direction. Mr. Cain again reported that the Boys and Gifts Club has nothing to be ashamed of, they have
everything to be proud of, and a lot of what Commissioner Williams has brought up is rumor and innuendo, not based in
fact, and he is not going to be apologetic or embarrassed. The organization has served the community well. He reported
he will be glad to meet with Commissioner Willjams on an individual basis at the Club, and to clarify all of her concerns
as best he can. He will also meet with the parents who have the concems. Mr. Cain reported he could have a local board
member, like Mr. Giannoni or Mr. Parsell, speak to the Commission.
Mr. Cain reported the Boys and Girls Club does not pretend to be perfect, and if there are deficits in their
programming, they would like to correct them. They would like the City to deed them the property so they could put some
significant resources into building a first class facility there. They have the capacity to do that, and they want to flagship
the Boys and Girls Club somewhere in Seminole County, whether that ends up in Sanford or not. Seminole County is the
longest serving location, and there is an area of great need that has been served, and they feel it is the right location. If the
City would like to go with another lease, they would be happy to do that as well. Commissioner Willjams recommended
that the City go with a lease with modifications. Mayor Dale recommended an extension of the lease on a weekly basis,
get the board members together, give Mr. Cain an opportunity to meet with Commissioner Willjams and sort out what is
fact and what is hearsay, and let some of the board members come back to the Commission. The Commission concurred
with the Mayor's recommendation.
RFP process for Hotel/Conference Center.
City Manager VanDerworp presented the ten steps involved in the RFP process, and distributed several
letters of interest which had been received, as well as some proposals. The City has completed the first five steps, and now
the decision needs to be made whether to do a feasibility study, or go out for proposals and do a feasibility study through a
potential developer. If the City does a feasibility study, it has the preferred option of talking to the different consulting
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firms that are in this business, and it would give the City a better idea of where it wants to go, how big this thing is, and
what potential developers could be solicited. Option B, which is often used as well, is the City completes steps one
through five, sees what developers are out there, and lets the developer do the feasibility study. The cost for the City to do
a study would be $20,000 to $40,000, for which the City Manager would have to solicit proposals; and Option B would
mean develop a color brochure and information packet and extensive mail-out, which could happen anyway.
Commissioner McClanahan reported he is not in favor of the City paying for a feasibility study, which the
developers may not be satisfied with anyway. Mayor Dale reported the developers would take the City's feasibility study
and restate it. He further reported if the Commission is serious about building a hotel and conference center, then the City
should do a feasibility study and an RFP, since it has received criticism for not doing either of those, unless the
Commission is not serious about proceeding with it. The taxpayers have voted to build one there, and the Mayor feels it is
the best site in Seminole County, with the lakefront and the avenues for public financing, and the private interest that has
been generated by the last eighteen months of activity. The City has received a great deal of interest in it. The Mayor
reported if the Commission is serious about it, they need to get serious about it, and put their money where their mouth is.
Commissioner Williams reported if the Commission was serious, it needed to do whatever was necessary to
move forward, and if they are not serious, just scrap it. City Manager VanDerworp reported by the City doing a feasibility
study it gives the City a better picture and a feasibility comfort level to send out to the big developers, and gets them
interested quicker. It also eliminates some of the unknowns in the process, which tends to expedite it. Commissioner
WiIliams reported after all the Commission has been through with this it should support the City Manager's
recommendation to move forward with the feasibility study.
Commissioner Lessard reported a feasibility study would facilitate more participation in the RFP process.
City Manager VanDerworp reported that one of the integral pans of this is to define how to improve the
public spaces. Mayor Dale reported that he has been contacted more regarding this issue than any other issue since he has
been Mayor. Further, he promised if the Commission wanted to move forward he would take the lead, and if it decided
not to proceed, he would never bring it up again. This will be voted on tonight.
Performance pay.
City Manager VanDerworp reported that the annual performance pay was done in accordance with the pay
and class plan, with $145,000 budgeted. The highlights show a higher level of performance accountability is in place, and
there is a more even mix of performers and top performers this year compared to last years' outstanding, top performers,
performers and developmental performers. Also, by achieving the higher level of performance accountability, the City
can provide a level of performance pay that provides a real reward, enough to make it more noticeable to employees.
While the rating forms and criteria were a vast improvement over the previous year, they still need to be updated,
reflecting nuances, for instance, in the public safety field. Out of the 14 or 15 comments from employees, about three of
them commented on the rating form itself. The City Manager also reported the Commission had said they would try to pay
employees, across the board, the same amount from one department to another. He is recommending that this year. Those
dollar amounts are: top performers would receive a one time performance incentive pay of $525.00 and outstanding
performers a one time performance incentive pay of $1,050.00. Also, the City still needs to strive to apply this uniformly
between the divisions. There were some divisions and departments that had, percentage wise, more top performers and
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outstanding performers than other departments, and he will be getting with those directors to go over thin issue. The City
needs to strive to have some across the board application of the performance and pay plan. He is recommending the
previously mentioned one time performance pay for top performers and outstanding performers. This will be voted on
tonight. There are other issues in the pay and classification plan which have been identified to be reviewed, and these will
be considered by the Commission in the near future.
Minimum Educational Requirements for City Employees.
City Manager VanDerworp reported it was put into the requirements several years ago that all City
employees needed to have at least a GED or High School education. Based upon recent discussion with residents, the City
Manager would like to have the Civil Service Board review the ability to have some positions that do not require a GED or
High School Diploma, but the requirement to work toward a GED or High School Diploma if h/red by the City. GED's are
free, so it would not be an expense to the City, but the City does have an educational reimbursement program that would
help. Mayor Dale reported there have been instances where the City has had applicants, especially in the heavy equipment
operator areas, who did not have a GED or High School education, but had many years of experience, but could not be
hired. He further reported it is sad when you have young people who for some reason (an abusive home, health problems,
financial conditions, problems with the law), did not finish their education, and now want to finish, that the City will not
let them earn a little money and continue their education.
job. The City ought to at least give them an opportunity.
If they would quit their education process, they would lose their
The Commission concurred that the City Manager and the
Human Resources Director review the requirements for all City positions and see what positions could have the previously
discussed requirements.
Board appointments.
City Clerk, Janet Dougherty, reported the Code Enforcement Board has two alternate member vacancies,
and Kay Bartholomew has resigned from the Waterfront Master Plan Steering Committee effectively immediately.
Reeular Agenda items. Add-on items. and other items.
A. City Manager VanDerworp reported the Commission had received a request to hold a Tenth
Anniversary program and dedicate Park on Park in honor ofMartha Yancey and Judy Wimbish.
Mike Kirby, Recreation and Parks Director, reported that November 5, 1999 is the tenth anniversary
of Park on Park, which was built by the people of the community. The request is to honor the two
' women who were the driving force behind having the Park built by dedicating the park to them. The
name of the park will not change, but a plaque would be placed in the park commemorating the
tenth anniversary and naming Martha Yancey and Judy Wimbish as the motivating force of the
effort to build this park, which was funded by the community. The Commission concurred. This
will be voted on tonight.
B. Commissioner McClanahan reported that some kind of recognition should be given to Viola Kastner
and other people who donated right-of-ways for the Rinehart Road extension. Mayor Dale reported
the City could work with the County to see if something could be done.
C. Mike Kirby, Recreation and Parks Director, invited everyone to the opening ceremonies of the
Golden Age Games, at the Civic Center, at 1:00 p.m. on Sunday, October 31, 1999.
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D,
being paid by a mortgage company.
liens.
City Manager's briefing.
Mayor Dale reported the request for waiver of liens which will be voted on tonight was placed on
the agenda because legally the applicant has a right to request the waiver. He further stated he
hoped no Commissioner would have the inclination to grant the waiver. Commissioner
McClanahan reported he did not understand why the City could not get notification to the owner.
Mayor Dale explained notification was sent to the last known address according to the tax rolls.
Commissioner McClanahan reported if it was the same address that tax bills were being sent to, then
they should have also received the notification. Mayor Dale agreed, but reported the owner claimed
she had not received the notifications. City Manager VanDerworp reported possibly the taxes were
The Commission concurred it was not in favor of waiving the
B,
D,
Front Porch Program. Charles Rowe, Director of Community Development, reported that Sanford
was not one of the six cities chosen by the State for the Front Porch Program. The State reported
that Sanford's application was put together well with no shortcomings, but they were looking for
communities with CDC's (Community Development Corporations) or non-profit organizations that
would carry the ball, rather than the City. Mayor Dale reported the City needs to find out how the
communities that were chosen did so well in the process, and emulate them. Commissioner
Willjams reported instead of the City making application, a non-profit out of the community needs
to apply, with the City as one of the partners. Mr. Rowe reported 75 applications were received by
the State, and the six that were funded were the greater south/central neighborhood in St. Petersburg,
Opa-Locka Front Porch Community, the Northwood Pleasant City northwest community in West
Palm Beach, the greater Frenchtown Community in Tallahassee, the Dorsey/Riverbend
neighborhood community in Ft. Lauderdale, and the greater Pensacola Front Porch Community. He
further reported that the State will hold one or two state-wide application meetings to give
additional direction on the application process before the next application period. The Commission
concurred to continue to monitor the process.
Evaluation of City Clerk and Administrative Aide. Diane Crews, Administrative Aide, received
an overall score of 39, and Janet Dougherty, City Clerk, received an overall score of 36. City
Manager VanDerworp reported he will rectify the numbers and pay incentive according to tonight's
add-on item for pay and performance.
Ridgewood Villas. City Manager VanDerworp distributed copies of a letter the Mayor received
with respect to Ridgewood Villas for information only. It will not be on the agenda tonight.
Basically the letter said that Mr. Shirkey is not partners with Mr. Sirianni, and went into some
background of what was going on with the property. They did fence up building four, but they did
not fence up the entire property.
Softball Magazine excerpt. City Manager VanDerworp distributed copies of an excerpt from
Softball Magazine, which talks about the ASA Super Nationals in 1999 in Sanford. Even though the
,qtadinm needs renainq the field is in neffeel ecmditicm
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E. City Manager VanDerworp reported there will be a public hearing tomorrow evening on the 46
Standards, which the Mayor and City Manager will attend to answer any questions the County may
have. Mayor Dale reported the County Manager's report on the status of the Conference Center
will be discussed, and City Manager VanDerworp requested the City Clerk find out when that will
be so he and the Mayor can be in attendance.
F. Commissioner Williams reported that she is 100% for the Boys and Girls Club, they do an excellent
job of supervising children, but it is mainly a babysitting service, and all she wants is meaningful
programs.
There being no further business, the meeting was adjourned.
Attest:
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The City Commission of the City of Sanford, Florida met in Regular Meeting on October 25, 1999, at 7:00
o'clock P.M. in the City Commission Room, City Hall, 300 Noah Park Avenue, Sanford, Florida.
Present:
Presentation:
Mayor-Commissioner Larry A. Dale
Commissioner Whitey Eckstein
Commissioner Velma H. Willjams
Commissioner Brady Lessard
Commissioner A. A. McClanahan
City Attomey William L. Colbert
City Manager Anthony VanDerworp
City Clerk Janet R. Dougherty
The Chairman called the meeting to order.
Mayor Dale presented a plaque of appreciation to Garnett White for his more than 40 years of service to the
City on several City Advisory Boards including: Board of Adjustment, Charter Revision Committee, Public Employees
Relations Commission, Planning and Zoning Commission, Zoo Relocation Committee, and others.
Citizen participation.
Jay Jurie, Sanford, reported the Commission's vote not to extend the PRA lease signifies a breathing space
for the City of Sanford and affords an opportunity for the City' s elected leaders to consider a broader brush approach to the
economic development needs, and strategize the type of approach for the benefit of all the residents of the City of Sanford.
Rather than allowing a single development project to draw the agenda of the City of Sanford, what would be more
reasonable is for the City to engage in some research, to do some homework, as to what might constitute the best economic
development strategy for the City of Sanford. There is a variety of tools to do so, they involve looking at the existing
economic base of the City, finding a creative profile, and then matching that profile with the type of development
opportunities that might best fit that profile. A better fit, or a match, would probably produce a more'satisfactory result.
Mr. Jurie also reported there have been a number of disasters in Central Florida involving school children
being struck by vehicles on the way to or from school. Mellonville Avenue, between approximately Celery and 20th, has
no sidewalks on either side and is about five blocks from Hamilton Elementary School. Children are walking in the streets
every day, so perhaps it is only a matter of time before an unfortunate injury, or perhaps worse, occurs, either on
Mellonville or some other street without sidewalks in the City of Sanford. He suggested, in conjunction with the School
Board if possible, a look be taken at enhancing the pedestrian safety within the City of Sanford.
Mayor Dale reported that working through the MPO the City has already secured funds, through grants, to
put sidewalks on Mellonville Avenue.
Millard Hunt reported the Commission is going to discuss the question of a feasibility study being funded
by the City, and he would like to know if there will be time, at that point in the agenda, for the public to discuss it. The
Mayor responded "yes".
Approval of Minutes.
On recommendation of the City Manager, Commissioner McClanahan moved to approve the minutes of the
City Commission October 11, 1999 Work Session; and October 11, 1999 Regular Meeting. Seconded by Commissioner
Willjams and carried by vote of the Commission as follows:
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Mayor-CommissionerDale Aye
Commissioner Eckstein Aye
Commissioner Willjams Aye
Commissioner Lessard Aye
Commissioner McClanahan Aye
Consider waiver of one year waitin~ period to reapply for rezoning for Westlake Plantation/Rose Hill Phase H.
70.41 acres of property lyinff between Rose Hill Trail extended easterly and Pine Way and between South
Mellonvi!le Avenue and South Sanford Avenue (4045 South Sanford Avenue). Westlake Plantation, Inc., applicant;
Michael Murray, President as agent. Ad published October 14, 1999; owners notified October 13, 1999; property posted
October 14, 1999.
Mayor Dale reported the developer of Westlake Plantation has revised the plan considerably and, after
working with a number of property owners in that area through the Mayor's office has requested a waiver of the one year
Mayor Dale reported the Commission would hear from those persons present to speak for, or in opposition
waiting period.
to, the waiver.
Commissioner Eckstein reported the Commission would not be voting on the number of units. Mayor Dale
concurred and reported it would just be voting on letting them go back through the process with a new plan. The Mayor
reported he has seen the new plan, from working with them on developing the plan, and working with some of the
homeowners in the area, but the rest of the Commissioners would see the new plan when it goes through the process,
which is the purpose of going through the process.
Commissioner McClanahan asked what kind of density was being proposed, and Mayor Dale reported 250
lots, and initially it was 340+. Commissioner McClanahan reported that is still not the rural nature of the area, and he
would not be receptive to the 250 lots.
A homeowner in the area provided the Commission with a copy of the new proposed site plan.
Marilyn Whitmer, 1805 Pineway Drive, asked that the Commission not grant the wavier requested by Mr.
Murray. The proposed zoning change for Westlake Plantation has been before the City twice. The Planning and Zoning
Board was the first to reject it, and the City Commission was the second. Their Homeowner's Association was invited by
Mayor Dale to meet with the developer subsequent to the City Commission meeting that voted down this zoning change.
About a dozen homeowners were in a room at City Hall with the developer Michael Murray, his son, his engineer, his
lawyer, the Mayor and others. At that time Mr. Flynn, a member of their Association and a civil engineer, presented
several scenarios to Mr. Murray whereby a development might be built that would be more suited to the rural character of
the neighborhood, and still make Mr. Murray a nice profit. Mr. Murray was very clear, he presented them with the very
same planned development that was presented to the Commission with lots averaging fifty feet wide. Mr. Murray advised
them that he was not willing to reduce the number of lots. His excuse was that the neighborhood would not support more
expensive homes on larger lots. He apparently has not taken notice of all of the homeowners who live there, nor the new
development on Hester and Myrtle, where homes range from $130,000 to $170,000. Mr. Murray simply does not want to
reduce his profit margin, and will not reduce the number of lots. A few weeks after this meeting the homeowners were
presented with a plan with twenty fewer lots, which is what was provided to the Commission earlier. This would still have
the majority of lots 50' wide. This is in a neighborhood where most of the homeowners live on five acres or more. At the
meeting at City Hall, Mayor Dale let the homeowners know in no uncertain terms that if they didn't accept this planned
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19--
development, they may very well get something much worse well down the road, and he may not be able to help them in
that situation. He stressed that in three years there would probably be a new City Commission that may not see fit to keep
their neighborhood rural. The Mayor taped the entire meeting, so it is available for any of the other Commissioners to
hear. The issue is that-Mr. Murray doesn't want to make less money by building fewer homes, so why grant his waiver.
Both the Planning and Zoning Board, and this Commission, suggested not changing the current restriction of no more than
one home per net acre. Mr. Murray wants to put homes on 50' lots. What is the point of having him present more plans
before the Commission, it will simply be a waste of everyone's time. Sanford has the opportunity to take advantage of
growth, and still keep its rural atmosphere, that's the charm of Sanford. Has anybody been to Oviedo lately? This
Commission can make a difference. Land cannot be manufactured, what is here is all there is ever going to be. Please
don't give Mr. Murray and other developers an opportunity to pave it over with concrete.
Commissioner Eckstein reported there are two different issues. One is the idea of a waiver, which he is
going to vote for, but that does not mean he is going to vote for the site plan that he just saw. The purpose tonight is to
decide if the Commission wishes to grant a waiver to see and negotiate what will be built. He will approve the waiver
because the gentleman has a right to present a plan to the City Commission, and the Commission has a right to comment
on it and further compromise if necessary. The two are mutually exclusive.
Ms. Whitmer reported the waiver would prevent him from continually coming back. She would like the
Commission to take note that the developer has eight units per acre in the plans that were provided tonight.
The developer's son reported that all that is being asked for tonight is to come back and waive the one year
period. They believe they have the right to come back and present the Commission with something in a more agreeable
situation, and that deserves an opinion, just as the homeowners as residents of Seminole County deserve an opinion. The
homeowners do not have an objective opinion, they are pretty much lopsided. The majority of the homeowners do not live
in the City of Sanford and they cannot comment saying this brings them tax revenue to enhance their community. This is
strictly something out of their jurisdiction. He reported the developer was not here to discuss density, just to request a
waiver of the waiting period.
Another homeowner from this area reported if the rezoning goes through it will make it easier for the
developer to put a higher density on the property. The new plan just provided to the Commission states that it is 3.66 lots
per acre. The concem is that the information the homeowners are presented with, every single time they come back for a
meeting, is not accurate. 3.66 lots per acre does not include any of the wetlands, does not include the park, and does not
include anything that is actually on the site plan. It comes out to be 4.32, but then it doesn't take into consideration
retention ponds, and he doesn't list what the retention ponds are. They figured them at 3.33 acres for a retention pond,
which the developer is showing on the site plan, which now brings the density up to 5.21 lots per acre, and that is not
counting roads or anything else. The homeowners have spoken with the County, and the Commissioners, and have
attended those meetings. She reported concern with the traffic volume and the other things that will occur, with the new
plan showing an entrance only from South Sanford (having been changed from Pineway), which will be the main
thoroughfare. The information presented on the traffic study was not accurate because it did not even show the main
entrance, South Sanford Avenue, on the traffic study. She reported the homeowners are concerned that every time the
developer gets an opportunity to have a waiver, and they have to come back for meetings, the information is not being
152
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presented accurately. They are further concerned that the Commissioners have not received any of this information, and
there is such a pressure for this developer to be able to develop this piece of property. The Commissioners have voted
against it before, and the Planning and Zoning Commission voted it down for a much lower density than what it is now.
The Planning and Zoning people spoke two meetings ago and actually begged him to submit it back through. The
homeowners want to know why there is such a pressure, basically from only a couple of people, for this particular project
to go through. If the developer gets this rezoning accepted' by the Commission, are the homeowners going to have to
continue to go against this type of pressure, where the people who are elected to decide these issues, and the people who
actually have the knowledge to do planning and zoning, are not having their recommendations accepted as to what they
think would be good in this area? All of the property around the property being annexed is County property, and the
County does not want to take on the cost of doing a lot of the improvements necessary if another 500 cars are from that
subdivision. As far as the tax rolls, the homes on Myrtle and Hester are $130,000 to $170,000 homes, which will be tax
revenue. The developer says he wants to build nicer homes, but he is taking out his tennis courts, his pools, and other
amenides so that he can keep shoving houses on these pieces of property, and that is just going to lower the actual value of
the plan.
Commissioner Eckstein reported the homeowners are putting a burden on the Commission by putting it
through all of this. He reported he went out to the area and the traffic is pretty bad, but in all fairness it is two different
issues. The homeowners are just going to have to trust the system. The homeowners have intimate knowledge of what the
amen/ties are or are not going to be, but the Commission has not got the slightest idea because they have not talked to one
developer. The Commission needs to study this issue. The lady said one of their concerns is that is why they are worried
because here they are in another forum this evening and the Commission is not aware of the information and has to vote.
Furthermore, they are worried that the next time it comes up for a very important vote they could be facing the same
situation.
Mayor Dale reported that one issue that has changed is that the intersection of Sanford Avenue and Lake
Mary Boulevard will not be a right-out only, it will allow traffic both ways. The lady reported that was not even put into
the traffic study so that is not their concern. Mayor Dale reported that it was one of their biggest concerns at the last
meeting. The lady said no, the concern is that it is a two lane road with no shoulder and with a lot of flood water, and the
roads are not going to be able to be expanded. You also have another 200 cars coming up from Myrtle, so you are looking
at another 700 cars on a two lane road, where school bus children stand fight on the edge where there are no shoulders.
The County is not going to pay. If the developer is going to pay to widen the entire road from Lake Mary Boulevard, down
South Sanford Avenue, and put in a turn lane (and it is not even wide enough to do that), that is one thing, but the County
is not willing. Mayor Dale reported the developer can address all of those concerns when it comes back through the
system, if it does.
Janet Sharp, Pineway, reported the developer is here to waive the year' s wait, but he has not proven to the
homeowners that he has put in a valid plan with the time that he has had. He seems to need that year to readjust his plans.
She does not feel the year's wait should be waived for the simple reason he needs the time for the evaluations on the traffic
and all that other stuff that has been discussed. How can he possibly be granted a waiver, when all of these subjects need
to be addressed, and he hasn't addressed them yet. Floyd just went through, and the developer needs to build up the
property in order to build houses, he has to adjust for the flooding.
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Marilyn Thompson, Pineway, reported Mr. Murray did this behind the Commission's back. She saw the
plan months ago. Jay Marder, and Mr. Dale, got with Mr. Murray behind the Commission's back, and came up with this
plan. That's three people against the Zoning Board and all you others. She doesn't think Joe Baker wants him to have the
property. She lives on Pineway, and the most gorgeous herd of cattle you ever could see is on that property again. Please
do not grant this man the waiver, go elsewhere Mr. Murray, we don't want you unless you are willing to do one house per
acre. That is what the law says, don't try to change it. Why do you need a year to evaluate it, you have 250 homes on 50
useable acres? Is that year to beat us down? Do not grant these people a one year waiver to come up with three or four
schemes behind your back.
Mayor Dale reported he wanted to clear up the idea that he went behind someones back. He reported that
he did not contact the homeowners, representatives from the homeowners association called him and asked him to meet
with them, then he was asked to open the meeting up to all homeowners, which he did. After that meeting, he was
contacted by two more individuals and asked to come to a compromise. No one went behind anyone's back.
Ms. Thompson reported they just don't want Mr. Murray and his hundreds and hundreds of cars in their
little bit of horse country. Please leave it at a home per acre. Let this man go elsewhere with his money.
On recommendation of the City Manager, Commissioner Williams moved to grant the waiver of one year to
reapply for rezoning. Seconded by Commissioner Lessard.
Commissioner Lessard reported that this is two separate issues, and with the fees for HPB appeals and
Planning and Zoning appeals and others, whether it is a corporate or a private citizen, the Commission should not restrict
them from giving his or her account on a project.
Commissioner McClanahan reported he had made a motion to deny, and it did not receive a second. Mayor
Dale reported Commissioner McClanahan's motion was for one house per acre, then he revised the motion to deny and it
was seconded and passed four to one. Commissioner McClanahan reported if the Commission does not grant the waiver
for one year, it is not going to accomplish anything one way or the other, because someone else could come in next week
(some other name or some other potential buyer), and the Commission is still going to be faced with th~ same situation of
making a final decision on what happens to the property. That type of density is not appropriate as far as he is concemed,
but to tell this man he can't come back and present another application, or another plan, does not accomplish the mission
that the homeowners would like to have accomplished. This gentleman could assign that contract to somebo~/else~under
another name, and they could request a hearing.
Mayor Dale reported he wanted to make it clear that he did not contact these people, he did not pursue it, he
was contacted by them and asked if a compromise could be reached, and what the compromise was. He then went back to
the developer and spent a lot of hours on it, at their request, to come up with this compromise that the developer agreed to
do.
The motion was carried by vote of the Commission as follows:
Mayor-Commissioner Dale Aye
Commissioner Eckstein Aye
Commissioner Williams Aye
Commissioner Lessard Aye
Commissioner McClanahan Aye
154
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Second readine and adoption of Ordinance No. 3515 re: amend Personnel Rules and Regulations re: pay for work
during emergencies or disasters. Ad published October 14, 1999.
Ordinance No. 3515 was read by title. Mayor Dale reported the Commission would hear from those
persons present to speak for, or in opposition to, Ordinance No. 3515. No one appeared. On recommendation of the City
Manager, Commissioner Lessard moved to adopt Ordinance No. 3515, entitled:
AN ORDINANCE OF THE CITY OF SANFORD, FLORIDA, AMENDING ORDINANCE
NO. 3324 AND ITS AMENDMENTS TO AMEND SECTION 23.0 OF THE CITY'S
PERSONNEL RULES AND REGULATIONS TO PROVIDE PAY FOR WORK DURING
EMERGENCIES OR DISASTERS TO NON-EXEMPT AND EXEMPT EMPLOYEES;
PROVIDING FOR SEVERABILITY, CONFLICTS, AND EFFECTIVE DATE.
Seconded by Commissioner Williams and carried by vote of the Commission as follows:
Mayor-Commissioner Dale Aye
Commissioner Eckstein Aye
Commissioner Willjams Aye
Commissioner Lessard Aye
Commissioner McClanahan Aye
Second reading and adoption of Ordinance No. 3516 to rezone 25+ acres of property lying between Airport
Boulevard East and Marquette Avenue and between Red Cleveland Boulevard and Ohio Avenue (2250 Marquette
Avenue) from AG, Agricultural to PD. Planned Development, with conditions and stipulations. Dorothy
McReynolds, owner; Frank L. Pohl, Applicant/Trustee. Ad published October 14, 1999.
Ordinance No. 3516 was read by title. Mayor Dale reported the Commission would hear from those
persons present to speak for, or in opposition to, Ordinance No. 3516~ No one appeared. On recommendation of the City
Manager, Commissioner McClanahan moved to adopt Ordinance No. 3516, entitled:
AN ORDINANCE OF THE CITY OF SANFORD, FLORIDA, AMENDING ORDINANCE
NO. 3 117 OF SAID CITY; SAD ORDINANCE BEING A ZONING PLAN; SAID
AMENDMENT TO CHANGE THE ZONING OF A PORTION OF THAT CERTAIN
PROPERTY LYING AIRPORT BOULEVARD EAST AND MARQUETTE AVENUE AND
BETWEEN RED CLEVELAND BOULEVARD AND OHIO AVENUE, FROM AG,
AGRICULTURAL TO PD, PLANNED DEVELOPMENT; PROVIDING FOR
SEVERABILITY, CONFLICTS AND EFFECTIVE DATE.
Seconded by Commissioner Eckstein and carded by vote of the Commission as follows:
Mayor-Commissioner Dale Aye
Commissioner Eckstein Aye
CommisSioner Williams Aye
Commissioner Lessard Aye
Commissioner McClanahan Aye
Second reading and adoption of Ordinance No. 3517 to annex .28 acres of property lying between Panama Place and
1st Drive and between Scott Drive and S. Summerlin Avenue (1321 1st Drive). Rico and Dana Sharp. owners. Ad
published October 14 and 21, 1999.
Ordinance No. 3517 was read by ti~e. Mayor Dale reported that the Commission would hear from those
persons present to speak for, or in opposition to, Ordinance No. 3517. No one appeared. Commissioner Willjams moved
to adopt Ordinance No. 3517, entitled:
AN ORDINANCE OF THE CITY OF SANFORD, FLORIDA, TO ANNEX WITHIN THE
CORPORATE AREA OF THE CITY OF SANFORD, UPON ADOPTION OF SAID
ORDINANCE, A PORTION OF THAT CERTAIN PROPERTY LYING BETWEEN
PANAMA PLACE AND 1 ST DRIVE AND BETWEEN SCOTT DRIVE AND S.
SUMMERLIN AVENUE; IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE VOLUNTARY ANNEXATION
PROVISIONS OF SECTION 171.044, FLORIDA STATUTES; PROVIDING FOR
SEVERABILITY, CONFLICTS AND EFFECTIVE DATE.
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Seconded by Commissioner Eckstein and carried by vote of the Commission as follows:
Mayor-Commissioner Dale Aye
Commissioner Eckstein Aye
Commissioner Williams Aye
Commissioner Lessard Aye
Commissioner McClanahan Aye
Grove Counselin~ Center Site Plan and Right-of-Way Use A~reement.
J. R. Ball, Engineer for The Grove Counseling Center, displayed a rendering of the proposed site plan and
landscaping plan. The Grove Counseling Center is requesting site plan approval, and approval of a right-of-way use
agreement to allow the required landscaping to be located on City property adjacent to the counseling center site. Also, a
parking variance will be needed.
Larry Visser of The Grove Counseling Center, Inc. reported the existing facility is an old block warehouse
that has a lean-to structure on it, and has broken windows and a lot of broken glass in the parking area, with a big fence
around it and an old truck box sitting in the back yard. He then displayed a rendering of the proposed site reporting on
how they will change the physical appearance of the outside, improve parking along with on site and off site lighting, and
provide the functions which were presented at the Planning and Zoning hearing.
Mayor Dale reported the parking is 60 degree angle parking spaces, and Sanford's Code requires twenty
feet (and you can have a two foot overhang over the parking bumpers into landscape areas). These requirements are not
quite met on a couple of the spaces, but he would rather have the parking a little bit more over the overhang than to have
the travel aisle less than seventeen feet.
Mayor Dale passed the gavel to Vice-Mayor Eckstein and on recommendation of the City Manager moved
to approve The Grove Counseling Center Site Plan and Right-of-Way Use Agreement that has been determined by staff to
be appropriate. Seconded by Commissioner Williams and carded
by vote of the Commission as follows:
Mayor Dale retrieved the gavel.
Mayor-Commissioner Dale Aye
Commissioner Eckstein Aye
Commissioner Williams Aye
Commissioner Lessard Nay
Commissioner McClanahan Aye
Request for waiver of liens at 703 Osceola Drive.
Charles Rowe, Community Development Director, reported a letter was received from Kaye Dehaven
requesting a waiver of lot mowing liens dating as far back as 1990, and as early as 1997. Staff has recommended denial of
those waivers.
Commissioner Eckstein moved to deny the waiver as discussed during today's Work Session. Seconded by
Commissioner Williams and carried by vote of the Commission as follows:
Mayor-Commissioner Dale Aye
Commissioner Eckstein Aye
Commissioner Williams Aye
Commissioner Lessard Aye
Commissioner McClanahan Aye
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Authorize the Seminole County Court to use the City Commission Chambers each Wednesday in 2000 from 2:00
P.M. until approximately 5:00 P.M. for the Traffic Infraction Hearing Officer Program.
Janet Dougherty, City Clerk, reported the Seminole County Court System has been using this room for the
traffic infraction hearing officer program. This was placed on the agenda because they request a committed use each
Wednesday, from approximately 2:00 p.m. to 5:00 p.m. This would be booked now, and if any boards or anyone else came
in afterwards requesting use of the room, it would already be in use.
Commissioner Eckstein reported that on Monday morning the jurors are sent to City Hall, because that is
when they select the jurors and go through the various courts and allocate various jurors to the different judges. Up to 200
people sit in here, and now they are asking for the room for Wednesday also, and there is wear and tear that goes on when
a number of people come in here. The City needs to consider charging for parking. The City is now doing a study to see
what other cities are doing, but there is a lot of valuable property in Sanford, and the City is doing a lot of favors, but the
City is getting absolutely no revenue from all of this parking, like Orlando and some other cities. He strongly urged the
Commission to consider charging for parking, not only at City Hall, but across from the Court House in the City's parking
lots, where the City can receive maybe several hundred thousand dollars in revenue and that would defray some of the
costs of projects that the City wants, and what goes on in City Hall. He reported the Commission should study this, and
talk about it, and a Work Shop should be set up for this. He is 100% for charging for parking. He does not want to use
meters, but some of the new electronic devices.
Mayor Dale reported he can't think of any Court House that he goes to that he doesn't pay for parking. City
Attorney Colbert reported the Orlando Court House is the classic one where payment is made, but if you go to DeLand,
Daytona or Tavares, or some of those, there is no charge. The County parks on City lots for free in some of the other
areas, but not in the Orange County area. Commissioner Eckstein reported there isn't a Court House right across from the
City like we have here. City Attorney Colbert reported the DeLand Court House is in close proximity to the City Hall, and
there are designated areas for parking that are used by the public without fee. Mayor Dale asked if the Court House had its
own parking. City Attorney Colbert reported they have a small amount of specific parking for elected officials, and
Constitutional Officers, but not for employees. Commissioner Eckstein reported they do not park on City Hall property,
City Hall is a block away. Mayor Dale reported they may, but they have to walk. He further reported we have two parking
lots that we allow free parking in, as well as free on street parking. City Attorney Colbert reported DeLand has a limited
amount of parking for the Court House, but the overflow is at City Hall and in other public lots around that area. Mayor
Dale reported one of the other things that concerns him is that he has heard from some citizens, and from some
Commissioners, that Sanford doesn't do much for Seminole County, but that Sanford asks a lot from Seminole County.
He reported Sanford does a lot for Seminole County, such as selling them the library building for $1.00 to be used as a
library and now it is not being used as a library, and the City has not called that issue to task. Sanford lets Seminole
County park in the parking lot for City Hall to the point that citizens and visitors cannot find a parking place. Sanford lets
Seminole County use a great parking facility on the east side fee gratis, and there is a lot of things that Sanford has done as
the County Seat, like letting them use the City Commission Chambers at no charge. Janet Dougherty, City Clerk, reported
the Traffic Hearing Officer Program has used the Commission Chambers since 1995. The Jury Management books the
Commission Chambers for Monday on a week to week basis, if it is available. Commissioner Eckstein reported that when
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Bettye Smith was Mayor the County was always asking to use the Commission Chambers for one thing or another, if they
wanted to adjudicate doctors that were accused of things, they would always come here. Mayor Dale reported Sanford has
always been very accommodating, and will continue to be, but he wants them to realize the things that Sanford does gratis
for the County when Sanford starts asking for things in return as the County Seat.
On recommendation of the City Manager, Commissioner Eckstein moved to authorize the use of the City
Commission Chambers from 2:00 p.m. to 5:00 p.m. every Wednesday in the year 2000, for Traffic Infraction Hearing
Officer Program. Seconded by Commissioner Williams and carried by vote of the Commission as follows:
Mayor-Commissioner Dale Aye
Commissioner Eckstein Aye
Commissioner Williams Aye
Commissioner Lessard Aye
Commissioner McClanahan Aye
Commissioner Eckstein requested the Mayor agenda the issue of charging for parking, and the Mayor agreed.
Use of City Commission Conference Room by the 18th Judicial Circuit Grievance Committee D. of the Florida Bar.
Mayor Dale reported the Florida Bar has requested use of the City Commission Conference Room from
2:15 p.m. to 4:15 p.m. on the first Tuesday of each month for the year 2000. He asked if this conflicted with anything we
have scheduled now. Janet Dougherty, City Clerk reported "no", things are usually booked a year at a time around this
time of the year, such as different boards and committees and outside requests such as this, and it is pretty much a first
come, first served basis. City Attorney Colbert reported Seminole and Brevard Counties are in the 18th Judicial Circuit.
He further reported he had served on this committee in the past, and the purpose of the committee is if someone wants to
complain against a lawyer, it is assigned to the grievance committee and the Circuit where the lawyer practices, and
hearings are held. They try to schedule the hearings in public or semi-public buildings because those matters can be open,
and it takes on the characteristics of a hearing. Commissioner Eckstein moved to approve use of the City Commission
Conference Room by the Florida Bar on the specified dates in the year 2000. Seconded by Commissioner Williams and
carried by vote of the Commission as follows:
Mayor-Commissioner Dale Aye
Commissioner Eckstein Aye
Commissioner Willjams Aye
Commissioner Lessard Aye
Commissioner McClanahan Aye
Boards.
Code Enforcement Board. The City Clerk reported the are two alternate member vacancies. No action was taken
on this board.
Waterfront Master Plan Steering Committee. The City Clerk reported Kay Bartholomew has resigned from the
Committee effective immediately. The Commission accepted Ms. Bartholomew's resignation. No Other action
was taken on the board.
Consent Agenda.
On recommendation of the City Manager, Commissioner Lessard moved as follows:
Reject all bids for installation of sewage pump station for the swimming pool at Seminole High School.
Lift station package will be provided by contractor.
158
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Approve Change Order # 1 to Maxwell Contracting in the amount of $84,769.65, for relocation of utility
lines from West 251h Street to Country Club Road, due to the proposed Expressway project.
Authorize to retain six consultant firms for planning related services as needed. Firms are Solin &
Associates; Glatting, Jackson, Kercher, Anglin, Lopez & Rinehart; Herbert-Hallback, Inc.; Land Design
Innovations, Inc.; Ivey Harris & Walls, Inc.; and Florida Planning Group.
Approve street closure: First Street from Oak Avenue to Palmetto Avenue on January 15, 2000, February
19, 2000, March 18, 2000, April 15, 2000, and May 20, 2000 from 5:00 p.m. to 9:30 p.m., in conjunction
with Main Street Cruise sponsored by Sanford Main Street, Inc.
Approve street closure: Ninth Street from Cypress Avenue to Pine Avenue on October 30, 1999 from 9:00
a.m. to 5:00 p.m., in conjunction with Church Family Day sponsored by St. James AME Church.
Approve street closure: Magnolia Avenue from llth Street to 12th Street on November 6, 1999 from 1:00
p.m. to 5:30 p.m., in conjunction with Magnolia Avenue Block Party requested by resident/police officer
Claudia Webber.
Approve street closure: Hickory Avenue from 6th Street to 7th Street on November 13, 1999 from 9:00 a.m.
to 7:30 p.m., in conjunction with City Wide Youth Crusade sponsored by Collecting Kids for Christ.
Accept parcel 2 of the Pinecrest property, subject to a clear title, boundary survey and environmental
assessment.
Approve Facilitation Agreement for McCracken Road.
Approve purchase of Mobile Communications Terminals for the Police Department, at a cost of
$51,330.00. A total of $32,340.00 will come from Local Law Enforcement Block Grant #98LBVX2200, and
$18,900 will come from the Law Enforcement Trust Fund.
Authorize the parking of recreational vehicles at the New Tribes Mission, 1000 East First Street, to be used
as housing for volunteers, from November 1, 1999 to the end of June, 2000.
Authorize Inte~ocal Agreement with Volusia County for mosquito and midge control services.
Commissioner Lessard thanked the Mayor for working out the mosquito district with Volusia County. Mayor Dale
reported City Manager VanDerworp and other staff member put in a lot of time as well on that project, and it will still be
quite time consuming. He further thanked Volusia County Board of County Commissioners for their support. The Volusia
County Board of Commissioners voted last Thursday to authorize this agreement, and Sanford will be working through the
State Department of Agriculture as we finally have an opportunity to control the mosquitos.
The motion was seconded by Commissioner Eckstein and carried by vote of the Commission as follows:
Add-on items.
A.
Mayor-Commissioner Dale Aye
Commissioner Eckstein Aye
Commissioner Williams Aye
Commissioner Lessard Aye
Commissioner McClanahan Aye
Dedication of Park on Park in honor ofMartha Yancey and Judy Wimbish. City Manager
VanDerworp reported this is not a renaming of the park, but a dedication ceremony and plaque.
They will be commemorated with something permanent on this site. Commissioner Williams
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moved to authorize a Tenth Anniversary program and dedication of Park on Park in "honor of'
Martha Yancey and Judy Wimbish.
Commission as follows:
Seconded by Commissioner Lessard and carried by vote of the
Mayor-Commissioner Dale Aye
Commissioner Eckstein Aye
Commissioner Williams Aye
Commissioner Lessard Aye
Commissioner McClanahan Aye
Providing office space for one year for the Intemational Council of Central Florida. City Manager
VanDerworp reported if this is approved a letter would be sent to them regarding this offer.
McClanahan moved to approve office space for one year. Seconded by
Commissioner
Commissioner
Williams and carried by vote
of the Commission as follows:
C. Proceeding with a feasibility study for the Conference Center. City Manager reported if approved,
proposals would be solicited and brought back to the City Commission for action.
Millard Hunt, 801 East 2nd Street, reported that he personally, and The Society for the Preservation of Fort
Mellon Park, feel the City should not fund a feasibility study for the benefit of developers who are interested in coming in
and putting commercial development on our major downtown park. This issue of who should do the feasibility study has
been debated a great deal, and he has heard opinions of various kinds about who really should do it, but the fact of the
matter is, if this Commission votes to do the feasibility study it is further use of taxpayers' money for this project, and a lot
of taxpayers' money has already gone into it in a lot of ways. Some of the cost to the taxpayers was incurred on behalf of
the developer who was, in a number of ways, questionable from the beginning, and the Society raised questions. They
believe if the City has developers who are interested in coming in and picking up the ball, it should be their responsibility
to do the feasibility study. As pointed out in the Work Session this aftemoon, even if the City does the feasibility study,
each prospective developer is, in effect, going to redo it anyhow. They are going to look at it and accumulate additional
information and make their own assessments on their own information, or whatever they can validate from the City's
study. Mr. Hunt urged the Commission not to do the study, and let prospective developers do their own studies, and they
will find out in the process many things that the Society has tried to point out, and will act accordingly.
Doreen Freeman, 705 Mellonville Avenue, reported she can't believe that the Commission is even
entertaining the thought of doing a feasibility study as a City. This is more taxpayers' dollars for something that has not
been proved that it will be effective. If it were effective, certainly Mr. Pacitti would have had his feasibility study and we
would have a building up. Why are the taxpayers having to pay for a feasibility study? She does not want it, and she
objects strongly to the Commission even entertaining the thought of wasting more money that could be utilized to beautify
that park. She wanted to talk to the Commission tonight about setting up a committee to move forward, if it didn't have
any more interested developers (which she strongly questions it does because these people would have come forward by
now and jumped on the opportunity since Mr. Pacitti is no longer in the running). Let's get busy and let's get the park the
way it should be. Let's tum it into another Lake Eola and have that :band shell, and have the boardwalk, and have all those
Mayor-Commissioner Dale Aye
Commissioner Eckstein Aye
Commissioner Williams Aye
Commissioner Lessard Aye
Commissioner McClanahan Aye
160'
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wonderful botanical gardens and places for people to go for open green spaces. But once again, the Commission is doing
it, it is sticking it to the taxpayers, and she is tired of it. She is going to make everybody she knows aware of what is going
on here, because she is going to attend every Work Session and every Commission Meeting, and she is going to make the
Commission responsible for what it is supposed to do. This is not right, she is very angry that the Commission could even
think to do this.
Jay Jurie, reported he has a technical question re: Robert's Rules of Order. Under Work Session No. 1 on
the agenda, which is Discussion of the RFP Process, it says for Hotel/Conference Center, but under Add-on item No. 3, it
says direction re: proceeding for a feasibility study for a Conference Center. Are we just looking at a conference center
now, or is this just a typo? Mayor Dale reported it is just a typo. It means both a hotel and conference center.
Nell Snow, 176 Woodridge Trail, reported she feels it is a good idea to charge for the use of the
Commission Chambers, forget the parking, that could get complicated, but if people want to use the Chambers they should
be charged for the use. She further reported when the Commission went through this thing years ago about the apartment
development near her home, the developer promised he would save the old growth trees, and that there would be no
construction within "x" number of feet of the little lakes, but Ted Williams reports that he has walked the land and all of
the old growth trees have been mowed down. If you are very careful with your driving on that winding part of the mad,
and look over beyond Viola Kastner's house, you will see there is a retaining wall, to be sure, to keep the debris .... Mayor
Dale inten'upted saying that is not the agenda item being discussed, but if she wished to discuss it she could do it later.
Ms. Snow reported that was just background information to show how things turn out. But, the Commission is talking
now about doing a feasibility study which should have been done initially, instead of wasting two years on Mr. Pacitti, who
still failed to come through. As is known, she is very much opposed to building anything on that park, it should, as Doreen
has said, be developed, or enhanced as it were, with proper lighting and plantings, botanical gardens, a water fountain, and
above all, the band shell sort of arrangement, so that Sanford could have some cultural events there that all of the citizens
could enjoy. That is her preference for use of that land, but she knows the Commission does not care what she wants, but
will be driven by what it considers to be progress. There are other areas, either directly on or adjoining the lakefront area,
where a hotel/conference center could be built. She even suggested to Mr. Fetzer one time that the Sanford Herald
location might be a good spot; they have a huge complex for their printing plant, and that certainly could be situated
elsewhere. There are other similar buildings that could be demolished with no great architectural loss to the City, but that
would save the park for the citizens. This business of giving away our park to some outside firm, is just corporate welfare,
and she is very much opposed to it.
Art Harris, 1108 Grove Manor Drive, reported he said he would not oppose the hotel, and he is not here
tonight to oppose the hotel, but he is opposed to spending taxpayers' money for what developers should do, such as
parking studies, and plans for downtown Sanford, etc. He didn't know when he spoke to the Commission four or five
weeks ago, about paying for different studies that developers should do, that the Commission would come up with another
one. He reported the Commission should consider the fact that it is now getting up into many hundreds of thousands of
dollars spending on downtown Sanford. If the Commission wants him to go with it and look at the taxes those people pay,
and see if they ever, ever, pay their own way, you will find out they do not. But yet the Commission is spending all this
money, and now going to spend some more money for feasibility studies. If the downtown merchants want a feasibility
study done, let them pay for it, but don't use taxpayers' money to pay for more money downtown.
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Ron Frazier, Scott Avenue, reported the Commission needs to start taking a look at the economic benefits
of parks and open spaces, and improving the parks. He has been doing research on this, and he has found that the retum on
investment is significant. Instead of burying our park in concrete and brick, and spending a lot of money on these
feasibility studies for the developers and such, why not take a look at the economic benefits of taking the park that we
have, and improving it; the whole park, not just the 700 easterly feet of it.
Mayor Dale reported he is in favor of moving forward with it, you need to be proactive if you want to bring
something of quality to Sanford, you need to go forward with gusto. We need to either put up, or shut up, on this. He
cares what the citizens of Sanford think, and what they said to do in a referendum, and he feels the Commission has been
given a charge to do and he is ready to do it. But, he stands ready to listen to the Commissioners' desires and where they
want to go with it. He will be out there with gusto and renewed vigor if the Commission votes to proceed with it, and he
will stay shut-up and never bring it up again if the Commission says not to.
Commissioner Eckstein reported it is not a black and white issue because this weekend the City Manager
and he went over the idea of a feasibility study, and his first reaction is why do a feasibility study when somebody else is
going to be coming in and redoing it and questioning the numbers. The efficacy of doing a study like this is incumbent
upon corporations with Boards of Directors, and they don't want to see what our study is. He agrees with what
Commissioner McClanahan said in the Work Session, and with what Mr. Hunt and Ms. Freeman said, and he wrote down
a quote of the Mayor of "ifyou're serious, put your money where your mouth is". He believes the Commission needs to
move forward with the strategic plan for the park, for all the enhancements that will be going into the park, and really do
something nice, and if we do something nice it will come. We spent $53,000 in taxpayers' dollars to fight a law suit,
which he did not properly defend, but that didn't seem to bother Mr. Hunt. If he hadn't gone to court we would still be in
the same situation, only $53,000 less. We need to use the $40,000 to get back part of the $53,000 we lost in that suit. He
always looks at money spent like this as 100 homes in his neighborhood, which pay maybe $40,000 in ad valorem taxes.
The City should not be in the feasibility study program because it is going to be questioned. We could take that $42,000
and start moving towards enhancements to the park, and if it is done right, the hotel and conference center will come. He
will be voting against the feasibility study, but not against the concept of the hotel.
Commissioner McClanahan reported he does not want to see the City spend that money for a feasibility
study. If someone has that much interest in it, and that mummoth of a project, the developer would not hesitate to spend
that small investment compared to the overall layout, to have his own feasibility study. No developer will accept a
feasibility study done by the organization that was wanting to push the project, they will want their own study to base a
decision on. He will not vote to spend the taxpayers' money for a feasibility study.
Mayor Dale reported the Commission spent taxpayers' dollars to send the City Manager to several
conferences and study groups, and he has come back armed with the data that this is the way to go, and he trusts that data
and the City Manager's knowledge in planning. He has listened to the public saying, over and over, that a feasibility study
needs to be done, and so he is prepared to move forward with it with gusto.
Commissioner Eckstein reported the City Manager did not disagree with what he said to him this weekend,
he said that is another way we could go. Mayor Dale reported he would not expect the City Manager to argue with a
Commissioner, but if you ask the City Manager which way he thinks the Commission should go, he will still say this is the
way.
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Commissioner Lessard reported he has been waiting for this RFP process for a number of months. The
Commission sent the City Manager to Arizona and CharleSton for a reason, and this will jump start that RFP process. This
will facilitate more RFP's coming in, and more bids to select from, and it is either going to happen or not going to happen,
depending on the merits or demerits of those RFP's. The City Manager might want to talk about simultaneously doing the
landscaping enhancements and things the City is planning on doing in that corridor and in that park. If the RFP's do not
come through, or even fithey do, that is going to have to be in place'.
City Manager VanDerworp reported when he got back from Charleston, he asked Jay Marder to put a map
together showing the area downtown, and it came out again, as it did in Tempe, Arizona, that a waterfront is the reason we
are getting interest, as is expressed in the five or six letters the City received. The City needs to begin laying out some of
those concepts to improve our public spaces downtown. The decision to integrate a closed Seminole Boulevard
into a park plan, versus knowing what the feasibility study shows and whether or not that road should remain open, is
something that cannot be decided on at this point in time. But, the City can begin the process, and besides having Mr.
Marder put the maps together, he has already scheduled a meeting with Parks and Recreation and with Planning and
himself to start on that project.
Commissioner Willjams reported she is in favor of moving in the direction of enhancing the park. Also,
when she thinks of the amount of time and effort that the Commission has rendered, in addition to all of the negotiating
and compromising, she is in support of the City Manager's recommendation of the feasibility study. She feels that either
the Commission needs to do whatever needs to be done to move in the fight direction, or just scrap the whole project.
On recommendation of the City Manager, Commissioner Lessard moved to direct the City Manager to
Seconded by Commissioner Williams and carried by vote of the
proceed with seeking proposals on a feasibility study.
Commission as follows:
Mayor-Commissioner Dale Aye
Commissioner Eckstein Nay
Commissioner Williams Aye
Commissioner Lessard Aye
Commissioner McClanahan Nay
D. Authorize awarding special performance pay. City Manager VanDerworp reported the performance
pay would be awarded in accordance with the Classification and Pay Plan, with the numbers as
provided to the Commission, and the funds already being budgeted. Commissioner Lessard asked if
consideration would be given to reconfiguring how the total budget funds would be distributed, and
if options would be looked at before next year. City Manager VanDerworp reported the Directors
will deal with those issues, and hopefully that will be done next year. Commissioner Lessard
reported he discussed with the City Manager coming up with a system whereby each employee,
regardless of salary, would have an opportunity to receive the big bonuses.
Commissioner Lessard moved to award the special performance pay in accordance with the Classification
and Pay Plan Administrative Guidelines for 1998/99. Seconded by CommisSjp~er Williams and carried by vote of the
Commission as follows:
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Information only.
Mayor-CommissionerDale Aye
Commissioner Eckstein Aye
Commissioner Williams Aye
Commissioner Lessard Aye
Commissioner McClanahan Aye
Mayor Dale reported there are three information items in the agenda packet:
A. Police ChiefBrian Tooley has reappointed four members to the Citizens' Advisory Board.
B. Two planned comprehensive plan amendments scheduled for 2000.
C. Summary of public education events for Fire Prevention Week, 1999.
City Manager VanDerworp reported the public education events show the fire department has been very
proactive in educating and assisting the public.
City ,Attorney's Report.
No report.
City: C!erk's Report.
No report.
City Manager's Report.
No report.
City:Commissioners' Reports.
Commissioner Eckstein - Discussion regarding the PBA building should be put on the agenda. Mayor Dale
directed the City Manager to add this item to the next Work Session.
Commissioner Willjams - Reported she has a high regard and respect for the mission and goals of the Boys
and Girls Club of America. The WeSt Side Boys and Girls Club of Sanford, which is located on Persimmon Avenue in
Goldsboro, has excellent potential for playing a vital role and providing activities and services that will meet the needs of
our youth and their families. However, there are only two things that she is concerned about, that is, that the Boys and
Girls Club of Sanford get its fair share of funds, especially those that are generated in Seminole County, and secondly, that
the programs they provide are adequate and meaningful.
Commissioner Lessard - Reported he received a letter from Mr. Wally King regarding a site for the new fire
substation. Commissioner Eckstein, Commissioner Williams and Commissioner McClanahan were copied on the letter,
and he assumes the Mayor was as well. He feels that at some time in the near future, the Commission needs to address
that in a Work Session. The Commission needs to find out how much money it has, where the viable spots are and
proceed forward. The reasons why can be discussed at the Work Session. Also, the Mayor and Commissioner Williams
had both participated in the Millennium Summit for Sanford, and it is interesting, when you look at the by-product of that
summit, how in tune those responses are with what the City Manager had facilitated at the Cultural Arts Center. Hopefully
the Commission will continue to pursue those.
Commissioner McClanahan - Asked why the fire station (No. 2) needs to be relocated. The Mayor reported
the fire station is inadequate, and the City is under citation by the State, it is a very small envelope, and it has health
problems. Commissioner McClanahan asked if the City didn't have enough land there. Mayor Dale reported we don't
even have enough room to do what we are doing on it, except for the graciousness of the adjacent land owner, who is
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going to develop it into a shopping plaza, so we will not be able to use it any more. We need to have a fire station in that
same general area of the south end. Commissioner McClanahan asked if the site the City owns on French Avenue would
be adequate. Mayor Dale reported that would be right next to Station No. 1. In order to have the response, and keep our
ISO rating up, we need to have a station on the south end of the City. Commissioner McClanahan reported the City needs
to look at some land that is a lot less money than what is setting there, because a fire station can be 200 feet off the road
and get to the road in a couple of seconds, it doesn't have to front on prime property. Mayor Dale reported it depends on
what value he gives us on the old fire station, if he is willing to say he would take that as value for value. He would agree
there is not much value there. City Manager VanDerworp reported the City has looked at a lot of different sites, and has
some more information, and this has not been discussed by the Commission in four months or so, and it would be a good
idea to bring it back. Mayor Dale reported this will be discussed at the next Work Session.
Mayor-Commissioner Dale - No report.
There being no further business, the meeting was adjourned.
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