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05.08.97AGENDA HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD Meeting May 8, 1997 City Hall City Commission Conference Room 300 North Park Avenue Sanford, FL 4:30 p.m. I. Call to Order and Roll Call II. Excused/Unexcused Absences III. Approval of Minutes April 10, 1997 IV. Applications for Certificate of Appropriateness COMMERCIAL a) 107 Magnolia Avenue - Right -of -way use in Magnolia Square for coffee cart and table and chairs V. Applications for Certificate of Appropriateness RESIDENTIAL a) 201 East 10th Street - Build small deck in rear yard b) 1011 Oak Avenue - Install porch sign VI. Acknowledgment of Minor Review Committee Actions a) 112 East First Street - Recover awnings b) 107 Magnolia Avenue - Repair windows c) 304 West 5th Street Install privacy fence in rear yard VII. Discussion Regarding 615 Palmetto Avenue - Mr. Edward Koch, Jr. VIII. Budget Approval IX. Certified Local Government (CLG) Program Update X. Other Business ADVICE TO THE PUBLIC: If a person decides to appeal a decision made with respect to any matter considered at the above meeting or hearing, he/she may need a verbatim record of the proceedings, including the testimony and evidence, which record is not provided by the City of Sanford (FS 286.0105). Persons with disabilities needing assistance to participate in any of these proceedings should contact the Personnel Office ADA Coordinator at 330 -5626 48 hours in advance of the meeting. ADDENDUM HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD Meeting May 8, 1997 City Hall City Commission Conference Room 300 North Park Avenue Sanford, FL 4:30 p.m. V. Applications for Certificate of Appropriateness RESIDENTIAL c) 918 Myrtle Avenue - Demolish Shed and Install New Fence d) 219 West 5th Street - Remove Jalousie Windows and Re -open Front Porch ADVICE TO THE PUBLIC: If a person decides to appeal a decision made with respect to any matter considered at the above meeting or hearing, he/she may need a verbatim record of the proceedings, including the testimony and evidence, which record is not provided by the City of Sanford (FS 286.0105). Persons with disabilities needing assistance to participate in any of these proceedings should contact the Personnel Office ADA Coordinator at 330 -5626 48 hours in advance of the meeting. MINUTES HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD CITY COMMISSION CONFERENCE ROOM CITY HALL MAY 8, 1997 4:30 P.M. I. Call to Order and Roll Call: The meeting was called to Sollien at 4:30 P.M. order by Chairperson Laura II. MEMBERS PRESENT: Laura Sollien Michael Skat Barbara Farrell Don Moore Scott Singeisen Helen Stairs Julia Goeb Jerry Mills Kimberly Kmett MEMBERS ABSENT: Jerry Gross Sica Nacu OTHERS PRESENT: Andrew VanGaale, Associate Planner Marion Anderson, Recording Secretary PUBLIC ATTENDANCE: Rami Yosefian Jennifer Singeisen Ed Koch III. APPROVAL OF MINUTES: Ms. Farrell moved to approve the Minutes of April 10th with the inclusion of Tom Freeman's concerns regarding the signage at 615 Palmetto; the use of the word "construction ", and statements of illegally passing as contractors; misrepresentation. Mr. Mills and Ms. Kmett abstained. Mr. Singeisen requested that he abstained from voting for the funding for the Florida Trust Conference be included in the same Minutes. Seconded by Ms. Stairs. All others in favor. Motion carried. Ms. Goeb moved to approve the Minutes. Seconded by Mr. Skat. All in favor. Motion carried. IV. Applications for Certificate of Appropriateness: Residential: a) 107 Magnolia Avenue - Right -of -way use in Magnolia Square for coffee cart and table and chairs: Mr. VanGaale stated that he would like some parameters as to the use of Magnolia Square. His recommendation is that the applicant utilize the front section of the building. Rami Yosefian was present for representation. He stated that the coffee cart and coffee tables are for the public. He would like to add fans for breeze in the square. The tables will be wrought iron, very attractive. Mr. VanGaale stated that if this use is approved, he would like to have the stipulation that either Main Street or public events will take precedence. Mr. Moore stated that he is opposed to the location of the coffee cart. He stated that it does not belong up front. Mr. Yosefian stated that it needs to be on the side because of the power. Mr. Moore stated that he hopes the coffee cart could be moved south to get it away from the end, off the street and away from the tree. MINUTES HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD MEETING OF MAY 8, 1997 PAGE 2 Ms. Goeb made a motion to approve the request for the coffee cart. Seconded by Ms. Kmett. After discussion regarding the tables, Ms. Goeb withdrew her motion. Mr. Mills moved to approve the coffee cart, to approve two tables as shown in the photographs for the coffee cart area, and to allow a maximum of 6 tables in front of the IOF building with the condition that any additional tables that are put out there have to come before this Board for additional approval. These tables are also the ones shown in the photograph. Two tables by the coffee cart and a maximum of 6 tables in front of his building to the width of the IOF building to the centerline of Magnolia Square. Seconded by Mr. Skat. Mr. Yosefian stated that two tables are not enough for the coffee cart. He needs at least a dozen. Mr. Mills amended his motion to push up the tables to 6 and 6. Mr. Skat seconded the amendment. Mr. Moore and Ms. Stairs opposed. All others in favor. Motion carried. RESIDENTIAL: a) 201 East 10th Street - Build small deck in rear yard: Mr. Skat moved to table until the Board has a final drawing with materials and it is drawn to scale, with the elevation of the deck. Seconded by Mr. Mills. All in favor. Motion carried. b) 1011 Oak Avenue - Install porch sign: Ms. Stairs stated that it is already installed. Ms. Sollien noted that it was done before there was approval for it. Mr. VanGaale stated that he was hoping Sica would be here because he didn't know what size it is. Mr. Skat stated that it is bigger than what the guidelines allow. Mr. VanGaale stated that the problem with our guidelines is that they only address signage in the downtown, there is no residential signage standards, which leaves this up to the Board's discretion. Ms. Kmett stated that it is not an unattractive sign but what concerns her is that it blocks the whole porch. Mr. Mills asked if he was missing something or is the most important element of this not being spoken about for any sort of a reason. He stated that the Board had a very big run -in with the owner of this property for completing work prior to having a Certificate of Appropriateness with this same property, it was the back corner porch and a bay. He stated that he is just amazed that all of a sudden the same thing, no lesson learned. Ms. Goeb stated that the most amazing part about it all is that she is now on this Board. Ms. Stairs stated that there was a sign approved for this house before. Mr. Skat stated that the appropriate place for the sign is out in the right -of -way or just on the other side of the right -of -way on the other side of the sidewalk so that it doesn't destroy the flow of the house. Here it is taking up half the porch. Ms. Sollien stated that they are usually placed on the fence. Mr. Skat moved to deny. Seconded by Ms. Kmett. Ms. Stairs suggested that it be located somewhere else. Mr. Skat asked if Staff would develop some guidelines for residential signage. All in favor. Motion carried. ADDENDUM: c) 918 Myrtle Avenue - Demolish shed and install new fence: Mr. Mills moved to approve because it is not MINUTES HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD MEETING OF MAY 8, 1997 PAGE 3 really a carriage house, its a shed and it has no continuity and design with the real house, it is a much later design, and based on the sketch that was presented. Seconded by Ms. Stairs. After discussion regarding the fence, Mr. Mills amended his motion to return the fence to the house at mid point and back behind the side door. Mr. Skat seconded the amendment. All in favor. Motion carried. d) 219 West 5th Street - Remove jalousie windows and re- open front porch; Mr. Mills commented that the standing seam metal roof is original, the ceiling boards on the inside are original, but there isn't an indication as to whether or not the turn columns will be put on. Mr. VanGaale stated that the applicant has the typical railings that have slats in- between, probably the old shorter ones. Mr. Mills moved to approve. Seconded by Ms. Kmett. All in favor. Acknowledgement of Minor Review Committee Actions: a) 112 East First Street - Recover awnings; b) 107 Magnolia Avenue - Repair windows; c) 304 West 5th Street - Install privacy fence in rear yard: Mr. Skat moved to approve. Seconded by Ms. Goeb. Ms. Stairs abstained. All others in favor. Motion carried. VII. Discussion Regarding 615 Palmetto Avenue Mr. Edward Koch, Jr.: He stated that when they got the Certificate of Appropriateness to proceed with the house as it was shown to the Board, they continued with the bid process. The end result was a cost of $150,000. They were trying to build one of the better houses in the area, trying to make it into something that it never was. $150,000 was a little more money than they wanted to put out. Their options included trying to find someone who wanted to buy it and they would build the approved home for the buyer. They put up a sign saying for sale and hoped that someone would call and ask to buy the lot. They were going to tell anyone that they have a design already approved that they would like to put on the lot and would build it for them. They could have cut back the size of the house and the fanciness of the house. They still can but they really wanted that house but they didn't want to do it with as much risk. It has sat there for a few months longer than they anticipated trying to get that end to happen but they haven't had a lot of luck with phone calls so they have to go back and try to come up with a smaller or different plan and have it come back before the Board. Mr. Koch stated that he understands there was a motion from the last meeting of building something similar to what was there or nothing at all. If this is the case, they have to research what was actually there. This is where they are. Mr. Koch stated that they were hoping that the selling price of the house would be in the $130,OOOs, which means the construction cost would be about $100,000. When the construction cost came in at $150,000 that was way out of what they were thinking. It could be scaled back but they fell in love with the design and didn't want to start chopping away at it. They were hoping that someone else would fall in love with it and may want to build it. Thats why they haven't done anything yet. He stated that they were not interested in selling just the lot. This MINUTES HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD MEETING OF MAY 8, 1997 PAGE 4 was the last option. They wanted to build something, and they wanted to build the house that the Board saw, they still want to, but it looks like they will have to start scaling it back and build something more along the price range they were thinking about. Which they can do, it just won't be the same appeal as it was going to be. Mr. Koch stated that going with a different or modest house is what it looks like they will end up doing. When they scale the house back down they will have to bring it back for approval. They had a lot of nice things on the inside that will have to go too. Mr. Mills stated that the Board has learned a valuable lesson about demolition in that maybe the Board should approve demolition only when someone has a contract to build something, or when they bring and show the Board the plans and the demolition is approved pending, and only at that time. Mr. Mills moved to extend the Certificate of Appropriateness pending a redesign of the property, which can only go for 6 months. Mr. Skat seconded. Mr. Skat asked that Mr. Koch come back in two months to give the Board an update. All in favor. Motion carried. VIII. Budget Approval: Mr. Skat moved to approve the $5000 budget. Seconded by Mr. Mills. All in favor. Motion carried. After discussion regarding photographing each home in the district, Mr. Skat moved to put the budget at $6000 for inventorying the residential district. Seconded by Mr. Mills. All in favor. Motion carried. IX. Certified Local Government (CLG) Program Update: Mr. VanGaale stated that we are nearly approved although its been quite a while. The original application submitted is lacking a few things, according to the Department of State, that they want to see for certification. We will need to adopt the requirements that will be placed upon us if we were to become a Certified Local Government and incorporate them into our ordinance. It is also mandating that we periodically update our inventory materials. Additional Requirements for Certified Local Government (CLG) Program: Procedural Requirements: 1. Provide State Historic Preservation Officer within thirty days prior notice of all meetings. 2. Submit minutes of each meeting to State Historic Preservation Officer within thirty days. 3. Submit record of attendance for the Review Commission (HPB) members to State Historic Preservation Officer within thirty days. 4. Submit public attendance figures for each meeting to Sate Historic Preservation Officer within thirty days of each meeting. 5. Notify change in the Commission (HPB) membership within thirty days of action. 6. Notify State Historic Preservation Officer immediately of all new historic designations or alterations to existing designations. MINUTES HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD MEETING OF MAY 8, 1997 PAGE 5 7. Submit annual report to State Historic Preservation Officer by November 1 covering previous October 1 through September 30. Public Participation Requirements: 1. Appropriate local officials, owners of record and applicants shall be given a minimum of thirty days and not more than seventy five days prior to Commission (HPB) meetings in which to comment on or object to the listing of a property in the National Register to be reviewed. 2. Objections by property owners must be notarized to prevent nomination to the National Register. Survey and Inventory of Historic Properties Requirements: 1. Duplicates of all inventory material will be provided to the State Historic Preservation Office and inventory material shall be updated periodically. 2. Commission (HPB) members are encouraged to participate in the survey and planning activities of the Certified Local Government (CLG). Commission (HPB) Requirements: 1. The Commission (HPB) shall be represented at pertinent information or educational meetings, workshops and conferences. 2. The Commission (HPB) shall review proposed National Register nominations within its jurisdiction. Ordinance Requirements: 1. Criteria for the review of proposals for alterations, new construction, relocation and demolitions set forth in the historic regulations should substantially achieve the purpose of the Secretary of the Interior's Standards for Rehabilitation and Guidelines for Rehabilitating Historic Buildings. Mr. Mills moved to approve. Seconded by Mr. Singeisen. All in favor. Motion carried. Ms. Farrell informed the Board that a C of A would be forthcoming regarding a downtown sign for the businesses on 1st Street. There was considerable discussion regarding the Mayor's Historic Preservation Award. Ms. Sollien stated that the Board needs to ask for one or more resignations of Board members. She feels real strongly that if you sit on this Board, you should know what the guidelines are and adhere to them. If you do work on your property, it is to be done with a C of A and if that simple requirement can't be met, you have no business being a representative of this Board that polices' other people. Ms. Sollien asked that resignation of board members and conflict of interests be placed as items on the next agenda. There being no further business, the meeting adjourned at 6:30 P.M.