012792-Work SessionMINUTES 238
City Commission, Sanford, Florida
J~n~'r~ 27
19 92_
The City Commission of the City of Sanford, Florida met in Work Session on Monday,
January 27, 1992 at 5:00 o'clock P.M. in the City Manager's Conference Room, City Hall,
Sanford, Florida.
Present:
Mayor-Commissioner Bettye D. Smith
Commissioner Whitey Eckstein
Commissioner Robert B. Thomas
Commissioner A. A. McClanahan
City Attorney William L. Colbert
Assistant City Attorney Donna L. McIntosh
City Manager William A. Simmons
City Clerk Janet R. Donahoe
Absent: Commissioner Lon Howell
The Chairman called the meeting to order.
Construction, installation, and maintenance of bus transit shelters.
Daniel B. Bellows, President, Community Services, Inc., appeared and reported that
he has been doing business in Central Florida for the past nine years, primarily in the bus
and shelter business. He stated that upon execution of an agreement (10 year minimum),
Community Services, Inc. will, at no cost to the City of Sanford, construct, install, and
maintain a minimum of two (2), with a maximum of thirty (30), bus transit shelters, at
locations to be determined by Community Services, Inc., Tri-County Transit and the City of
Sanford. Further, trash receptacles will be attached to each shelter, which will be emptied
no less than twice per week, and maintained by Community Services, Inc. Further, he will
provide at least $500,000.00 in liability insurance, plus a surety bond in ~muunt of
$1,000.00, and that he would be willing to increase said bond to $5,000.0~.
City Manager reported that the City of Sanford recently entered into an agreement
with Metro Systems, Inc., for installation of bus stop benches, and that one 'undition of
said agreement entitles Metro Systems to "right of first refusal", for installation of any
such transit shelters.
After discussion, the consensus of the Commission was to approve the concept of bus
transit shelters, and authorized City Manager to contact Metro Systems to obtain written
refusal, or an alternative proposal.
Site 10 - Citrus Lease.
George Wallace appeared and reported that he represents an investor group, which
consists of himself, and four other gentlemen who are present today. He briefly reviewed
Letter of Proposal dated January 21, 1991, which requests authorization to lease the 270
acres of "Site 10" designated for Citrus Grove Operation. He proposed that one-third (90
acres) of the 270 acre site be planted immediately, with remaining acreage to be planted as
production revenues permit; term of lease to be 99 years, with the City of Sanford to receive
5% of the net profit, after recovery of initial investment.
Paul Porter, Conklin, Porter & Holmes, appeared and reviewed various development
strategies and time tables indicating profit figures. He also described two Hay Crop
alternatives, which included: Bahia Hay, which would operate at a slight loss everyyear, and
Coastal Bermuda Hay, which W~uld yield a slight profit, but has a higher cost for initial
installation. Also, the City would not realize any revenue from Citrus Operation until the
seventh year.
MINUTES
City Commission, Sanford, Florida
239
January 27
City Manager reviewed the pros and cons of the proposed lease such as recognition
of estimated use of water on site, and commitment to use up to that amount of water unless
it would be deleterious to plants; escape mechanism; development of lease; and redesign
(engineering costs and contractor delay costs). Further, a decision needs to be made quickly
whether or not to proceed with Hay or Citrus Operation. Also, the cost of proceeding with
Hay Operation would be more costly, and would require Contract Negotiations and Change
Order(s), compared to continuing with Citrus Operation.
Mr. Wallace reported that he would be willing to negotiate various terms of the
lease i.e. length of lease, provision for "escape" clause, and the City's percentage of
profit.
After discussion, the consensus of the Commission was to authorize City Attorney
and Staff to meet with George Wallace, to negotiate a lease for Citrus Operation on Site 10,
and to hold a Special Meeting on Monday, February 3, 1992 at 5:00 o'clock P.M., to consider
said lease. Also, to abate City Commission action taken at January 13, 1992 Regular Meeting,
which directed Staff to proceed with Hay Operation on Site 10, instead of Citrus Operation.
Water Reclamation Facility Expansion Contract (Verbatim Discussion).
Mayor: Discussion regarding the Water Reclamation Facility
Expansion Contract.
City Manager: Yes, Mayor - We have some gentlemen here from ah, to -
to hear what we have to say about that. Ah - Mayor, um,
what we have here. We opened bids sometime ago, and we
received six or seven - ah - on that - ah - the iow
bidder - ah - provided information regarding his specific
minority business enterpriseS, however, he did not
provide any information, as required in the
specification, to be provided at bid time relative to the
efforts to which he had gone to solicit this particular -
'ah - this particular participation. Ah '- the
qualification of the particular MBE, which was very large
on this particular contract, was challenged by the second
Iow bidder - ah - represented by some of the gentlemen
here today, on the basis that - that it was not
certified. Ah - in fact, he was only certified a number
of years ago in - ah.
Mayor: You're talking about the highest bidder now.
City Manager: No - this is - the, the iow bidder
Mayor: I mean the iow bidder.
City Manager: The sub-contractor for the Iow bidder - the minority
business. Ah - DER's policy has been that they in the
past have taken - ah - certifications, assumed
certifications to be valid until they have reason to do
otherwise, ah - in this case, a challenge is viewed by
DER as reason to do otherwise. They're looking for a new
certification - ah - or valid current certification, if
one's available. Ah - we gave Koblar, who was the Iow
1992
240
MINUTES
City Commission, Sanford, Florida
January 27
19 92
bidder, until the 21st of this month to come forward with
a certification. He has not done so. It is the attorney
- the opinion of the attorney, that the way our
specification is written, that no substitution can be
allowed in this case because none of that information was
provided at the time of bidding. So, we have Koblar,
essentially - Incidentally, FDER has said that they will
not approve a tentative award to the low bidder absent a
proper MBE certification. So, there's our situation
relative to low bidder. Ah - the - ah - second lowest
bidder, Adams Robinson, who challenged the -ah - low
bidder is - ah - here today. Ah - we've had
conversations between attorneys on this, and - ah - ah -
our attorney has made - has made some recommendations
relative to the two alternatives that we have before us.
I just discarded one of those. The two alternatives that
we appear to have before us - one would be to award to
the second low bidder. Ah - the secOnd low bid is
approximately 13% higher than the engineer's estimate.
Ah - the other alternative, which I believe we~have open
to us, is to reject all bids and to go again. Ah - so -
these - this is what - what we have right now, at this
point in time. Ah - in conversations with the ah - or
actually by letter, from the attorney for Adams Robinson,
there has been a request to be allowed to speak to the
Commission, and - ah - while this a work' session, it is
not mandatory, I would recommend you - you give these
gentlemen a specified period of time to - to say whatever
they would like to say.
Mayor: (unable to understand) people here to talk (unable
to understand) for both
City Manager: Everybody's here from Robinson. We don't have anyone
here from Koblar.
Mayor: Okay. Mr. Colbert or Ms. McIntosh - do you have any
suggestions.
City Attorney: You can - ah - if you choose - ah - to give them a time
certain, three to five minutes, to state their position.
I think Ms. McIntosh and I would like, at some point,
just to - to - summarize your legal position.
Mayor: Since our time is running out - if you could please
summarize in about three minutes. Are you Mr. Kornreich?
Mr. Adams: No, I'm Mr. Adams. I'm President of Adams Robinson
Mayor: Okay - I had
Mr. Adams: Kornreich was - he's our attorney, and - ah - he has had
close contact with I believe your
MINUTES
City Commission, Sanford, Florida
January 27
1992_
City Manager:
Mr. Adams:
(unable to understand - two people talking at the same
time)
First of all, thank you for your time.
Com. Eckstein: He's our attorney too.
City Manager: No - different - different one.
Mr. Adams: Thank you for your time. You are not in a very good
position, not an enviable position you find yourselves.
Two quick points: #1 The first set of instructions to
your - to any bidding group, is -are - the bidding
instructions, and they've not been followed. Ah ~ we
listed a local minority business firm -ah - Witloby
Wilson - ah - and Company ,they're local to Sanford. We
stated they - ah - what they were going to be doing. We
complied 100% apart in - with the bid request. Ah -#2
There is a signal that is sent out to the bidding
community, and this is the perspective I want to get to,
'that's very important - ah - that you don't consider.
You're a public body - ah - this is not going to be the
last public work that you - you have to do. Ah - ~1 If -
if a - if a job is rebid, you're going to give the low
bidder, who clearly did not conform, or did not even try
to conform with your specifications, another opportunity
--two bites at the apple. And - and there's a walk away
theory in our industry that says - I'm not saying this is
the case, but - but this allows for a situation where a
contractor can come in. He can low ball a job. And I
don't look at it as we are 13% high. Ah - he was 13%
low, and my - ourselves and the next two or three
contractors, run a very tight shot pattern, if you will,
as they say, and - and - and the market has spoken as to
where the price of this job should be. Ah - if the job
is rebid, the low bidder clearly, at this point, can walk
away without supplying the information. He will not lose
his bid bond, and he can clearly come back for a second
day, having tested the waters of where this job is going
to bid, and in all probability his price is going to go
up. Our price is not going to come down. It's a tight
job. The market's tight. The competition is very keen,
and - and you're really giving the low bidder a second
bite at the proverbial contracting apple. In - in public
works contracting - ah - that's a signal to everyone else
out there, even the people who are not bidding this job,
to say that the City of Sanford will entertain
potentially - ah - a low bid. ~Throw it out, and then
rebid it, and this sets the stage for - ah - eventual
2 4 ,z MINUTES
City Commission, Sanford, Florida
J a~uar-y 27
19 92
Mayor:
problems in the bidding process. Ah - this is the only
kind of work that we do. We are a general mechanical
contractor. We specialize in waste water treatment
plants. We were contractor of the year in 1989 (unable
to understand) the City of Apopka's project for the
American Boiler Works Association. Ah - We know our
business, and we've been in it for a long time, and
worked in a number of states. Ah - I'm here to give you
this perspective of a problem that came from about --
that's above and beyOnd the normal discussion of do we
bid, or do we give to the second bidder, or do we give to
the low bidder. So - basically, this~is what I wanted to
share with you tonight. Ah - an -ah - I'm really hear to
answer any questions.
Thank you sir. We appreciate that. Anybody else have
any questions. Okay - Mr. Colbert
City Attorney: Okay. This is the night for the tough decisions it
seems. Ah - there was a bid package. There were a
number of bids that responded to it. Ah - I believe the
bids about $3,000,000.00 and 3,300,000.00 is a pretty
good spread between the top and the second one. They
both appear to be good companies. They're ably
represented by counsel. We've had discussion with both
of them. Both counsel are arguing their client's
position, and they're doing it very well. As we've gone
through it, and Ms. McIntosh has worked on some of the
details of it, and may want to add to what I say. And
we've go~e through it, and we believe the circumstances
the way they come - ah - that Koblar's bid, as it stands
right now, is non- responsive, and - and - ah - because
it is non-responsive, we believe it should be rejected by
the City. You then have the choice of - of going to the
second bid or not, and asking for re-bidding. If you go
to the second bid, as Mr. Simmons has already pointed
out, you're over the engineer's estimate, and - and - ah
- we've - we've had good service by the engineers, and -
ah - they've been on target on a lot of the estimates.
Ah -I'm not sure what Mr. Adams has said will be a fact.
I understand what he's saying. I, I understand that it
can occur that way. It would seem to me that if the City
chose to reject all bids, it could ask the staff to go
back through the specifications, and see if there are
some things that can be bid alternatively, and - ah - and
that way you could -ah - you could see what the bids are
when they come back. And if - if there is no change.
MINUTES
City Commission, Sanford, Florida
January 27
243
And if you are overbid -then maybe something that you
would - that you would be able to - to delete from it,
and stay within your budget, or could - ah - elect not
to. The - the second bid. Mr. Adams' bid is over
budget, and I think that's a valid reason that the City
could decide to reject all bids, and if you chose to
rejeCt all bids, of the three alternatives, that is
probably the easier one for us to defend, if somebody
wants to challenge it. I'm kinda trying to give you a
little bit of a practical and .little bit of a legal
perspective on it. This is the file, and Ms. McIntosh can
answer some technical questions. It has been a very
technical thing, and we've been looking at it for some
..several weeks. And I can't tell you that one is the
absolute best decision that you can make, but I - I think
- ah -leaning toward rejecting all bids unless - unless
you decide, as a policy, to do otherwise.
Com Eckstein: Ah - Another practical matter, which leads - leads me to
your conclusion is - we're talking about $400,000.00 -
talking about $400,000.000 - putting it out for rebid.
We could potentially save less :than that. I mean ah
City Manager: A comment I would make is I - I certainly agree with Mr.
Colbert's position of going back looking for things that
we can list as either deductive or additive bid items.
Really looking hard to see if there are some things that
we can squeeze. Much of what is in this particular
contract, which actually has caused considerable growth
from the original estimate of-this contract, it's grown
almost 1 million dollars, has been things, which FDER has
mandated go in there, up to and including, an elevator.
Mayor: Don't you love it.
City Manager: So - ah - there are a whole lot of things like that in
there.
Mayor: (unable to understand - two people speaking at same time)
City Manager: Whether or not we can work some of those or not - we're
basically about 1 million dollars over our state
revolving fund loan on this, and two other projects.
Mayor: Thank you very much. Um - this is on the Agenda, Item 11.
The Commission recessed for approximately 10 minutes. The Mayor reconvened the meeting.
Addendum No. 5 for Land Development Reg~lation Revisions.
Jay Marder, Director of Planning and DevelOpment appeared a briefly reviewed
Addendum No. 5, to original Agreement dated April 10, 1989 with Solin and Associates, for
Land Development Regulation Revisions.
19 a.
244
City Commission, SanfOrd, FlOrida
January 9_.7 199~
Sanford AirportAuthorit¥.
Mayor Smith reported that at tonight's Regular Meeting she will be proposing that
the Sanford Airport Authority be expanded to nine members, and suggested that the Commission
consider appointing Gene Daniel and Ronald Weindruch to serve on said board.
Cemetery Maintenance Contract, tabled at January 13, 1992 Regular Meeting.
City Manager reported that according to City Charter, the City is unable to award
the Cemetery Maintenance Contract to the second low bidder because said bidder is a City
employee. Also, he has requested City Attorney to research whether or not the City can hire
City employees to temporary contractual part time positions.
Public Employee Relations Commission.
City Manager recommended that David Ligler, Manager, Lake Mary Publix Store, be
appointed to the PERC, and requested that the Commission confirm said appointment at
tonight's Regular Meeting.
Refunding of Certain Outstanding Water and Sewer Revenue Bonds.
City Attorney reported that due to lower interest rates, the City may be able to
receive a refund of certain outstanding Water and Sewer Revenue Bonds, and that he has
prepared a resolution for City Commission consideration at tonight's Regular Meeting
regarding same.
Constitutional Amendment for Voter Control of City Taxes. The Commission concurred not to
support said amendment, and instructed City Manager to prepare a letter regarding same.
Affordable Housing.
City Manager reported that Ralph Schmidt and Frank Shunock have requested City
assistance to gain points for additional tax credits, for possible Affordable Housing
initiative. Said requests include: 1) The City will accept a donation of land, for further
donation to the development as a means of creating City financial involvement, 2) City
contribution of compensatory easements of land should wetlands need to be developed, and 3)
City consideration for density bonus if one is required. City Manager stated that City
Attorney recommends conceptual approval to accept donation of land, subject to receipt of
favorable environmental audit prior to ownership change.
Trash and conduct at Food Stamp Office.
City Manager reported that relative to City Commission's direction at January 13,
1992 Regular Meeting, he met with an HRS representative to resolve the trash problem which
exists at the Sanford Food Stamp Office, and that he has arranged to provide litter
containers and signs for recommended parking areas.
Requests for Special Event Permits.
City Manager reported that with no objections from the Commission, he will handle
three requests for Special Event Permits, as follows: 1) From Comair, for Air Show at
Sanford Airport on February 2, 1992, and 2) From Holiday Inn, for two Jet Ski Races. The
Commission had no objections.
There being no further business, the meeting was adjourned.
Attest:
City Clerk